Peter Ramsay loose ends

Just a note about where I’m at with Ramsays. I know that Peter Ramsay was a Vinter/Inn Keeper Stabler and brother to William Ramsay, Esq. (proprietor of Barnton), and father of the late William Ramsay, Esq., (banker) from a number of sources including Kay’s Originals Vol. 1 (p. 184 Biographical Sketches: Thomas Fraser – a natural). I also know that Peter Ramsay ran the “White Horse” Inn, in St. Mary’s Wynd and Cassell’s Old and new Edinburgh : its history, its people, and its places ([1881-83?]) by James Grant has the following to say about his fortunes and offspring:

Ramsay’s inn was chiefly famous for its stables, and in that establishment he realised a large fortune. … In 1776 he advertised that, exclusive of some part of his premises recently offered for sale, he possessed “a good house for entertainment, good stables for above one hundred horses, and sheds for above twenty carriages.” He retired from business in St. Mary’s Wynd in 1790, with above £10,000, according to one account, and his death is thus recorded in the “Scottish Register.” “Jan. 1. 1794. At his son’s house of Gogar, Co. Edinburgh, Peter Ramsay, Esq., formerly an eminent innkeeper at the Cowgate Port, in which station he acquired upwards of £30,000. He has left one son, William Ramsay, jun., Esq., banker in Edinburgh, and one daughter, the widow of Captain Mansfield, of the South Fencible Regiment, who lost his life at Leith in 1779, when attempting to quell a mutiny.”

As mentioned in my last Ramsays and Mansfields, the REGISTER OF MARRIAGES For the Parish of Edinburgh mentions an Agnes Brown married a Peter Ramsay (stabler) on 2 Mar. 1760. There’s a possibility that this is the same Peter Ramsay. The Parish of Edinburgh records also mention that a James Mansfield, captain lieutenant in 7th regiment of Dragoons, and Miss Margaret, d. to Mr. Peter Ramsay of Wariston in county of Midlothian, in Tolbooth on 16 Sept. 1770. I would say it’s highly likely that this is the same Peter Ramsay and daughter mentioned in the snippet above.

As mentioned above, Captain James Mansfield was killed in Leith in 1779 during the Mutinies of the Highland Regiments, although it’s hard to tell by the account whether this was a mutiny or culture clash or misunderstanding or bad leadership or a combination. Here’s an extract from Cassell’s Old and new Edinburgh : its history, its people, and its places ([1881-83?]) (Volume: 3) by James Grant:

Captain James Mansfield (formerly of the 7th or Queen’s Dragoons), while attempting to save the latter, was bayoneted by a furious Celt, whose charge he vainly sought to parry with his sword. A corporal shot the mutineer through the head : the Fencibles — while a vast crowd of Leith people looked on. appalled by a scene so unusual — now closed up with charged bayonets, disarmed the whole, and leaving the Shore strewn with dead and dying, returned to the Castle with twenty-five prisoners, and the body of Captain Mansfield, who left a widow with six children, and was interred in the Greyfriars churchyard.

I’m not sure what happened to Peter Ramsay’s daughter Margaret, although a Mrs. Margaret Mansfield, is granted a pension of £150 in May 28, 1779 by the Barons of Exchequer Edinburgh. I presume it’s the same person and I also assume that the Miss Mansfield, daughter of the late Captain James Mansfield that’s mentioned in Sir Walter Scott’s The Edinburgh annual register‎ as marrying Samuel Rice, Esq (Lieutenant-Colonel of the 51st regiment of foot) in 1816 is her daughter. That’s about as much as I have found on Margaret and her family.

He some William Ramsayy jun. (banker) married Bethia Hamilton, daughter of Robert Hamilton, 6th of Wishaw and Susan Balfour. Bethia’s sister Jean Hamilton married William’s cousin George Ramsay son of William Ramsay senior, i.e. William junior’s uncle, the brother of Peter Ramsay.

Peter Ramsay (Innkeeper) died at what is now known as Gogar Castle and is buried in the graveyard there. I think his son William (junior) may have lived there, but the house seemed to have been owned by Peter’s brother William (senior).

I’m pretty certain that William Ramsay and Bethia Hamilton had at least five children: Peter (married his cousin Susan Mary Hamilton 1820), Mary Euphemia (married Sir Thomas Woollaston White of Wallingwells, 2nd Bt. 1827), Bethia Hamilton Ramsay (married Andrew Carrick-Buchanan 1826), Margaret Sibella (married Alexander James Hamilton, 12th of Orbiston) and Robert … partly because they are named in a dispute over the estate of William Ramsay junior. I’m not sure whether he married or not, but his share of his father’s estate became a legal dispute on his death between his two surviving sisters (Mary and Bethia) and their older brother Peter.

Gogar Bank House
Gogar Bank House

Peter Ramsay was a banker in Edinburgh just like his father (William Ramsay senior) and his great uncle (William Ramsay senior). He was given Gogar Bank House by his father William in 1821 and he sells it to Sir William Fettes of Comely Bank purchases with consent of father’s trustees for £17,050 in 1824.

They had one child, Georgina born 18th November, 1825. It is not known when his first wife died, he married again in 1827 to

Mary Euphemia and Sir Thomas Woolaston White had a daughter born on 16th July, 1829. It appears that Sir Thomas was succeeded by (see here) by his eldest son Lieutenant Colonel Thomas Woolaston White who was born in 1828, but I don’t know whether he was the son of Mary Euphemia. Sir Thomas had been previously married to Mary Euphemia’s cousin Georgina (daughter of George Ramsay) and before her death they’d had a daughter, Georgina born 18th November, 1825. She married Col. the Hon. Horace Manners Monckton in 1856, but it seems she died before having children (see here). Lieutenant Colonel Thomas Woolaston White died unmarried.

If Robert did marry he didn’t have surviving children. According to Stirnet Andrew Carrick-Buchanan and Bethia Hamilton Ramsay (dau of William Ramsay of Gogar) had issue, but that’s as far as I’ve been able to get Peter Ramsay and Susan Mary Hamilton had issue but I can’t trace any descendants.

I’m more interested though in tracing the ancestors of Peter Ramsay the InnKeeper. As mentioned in my A Ramsay snippet – William and Peter’s father?, I found the following snippet about my Ramsay ancestors via Google Books From Stage-coach to John O’Groats by Leslie Gardiner (1961):

“One was William Ramsay of Barnton, whose father, years ago, had made a small fortune out of inns and stabling in Edinburgh’s Canongate and whose brother had more recently cornered a a useful slice of the cornered a useful slice of the stage-coach and mail business on the Dumfries and Carlisle roads.”

I’ve found a mention in one of the registers on Scotsfind (see here) of a staymarker called George Ramsay involved in some sort of dispute with his wife Elizabeth (Paterson?), and it refers to him as son to the deceased George Ramsay, stabler in the Canongate. Perhaps this George Ramsay is the father of William and Peter and is my ancestor.

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3 thoughts on “Peter Ramsay loose ends

  1. Interesting history on Peter Ramsay and The Hon Susan Mary Hamilton. Their portraits looked down on me as a boy eating my morning breakfast! Their daughter Agnes (sister of Dr Robert Hamilton Ramsay fiend and colleague of Lord Lister) married my great grandfather Francis Beck. I would be glad to discuss further details.

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